AEW's Tony Khan acquires Ring of Honor

News
42

Stop it… .

Best summed up by this that I read yesterday.

https://twitter.com/pwoloss/status/1501635050802196484?t=6VrQxTivd82yYZmjZtFz2Q&s=19

https://twitter.com/pwoloss/status/1501635724826796051?t=nbX35cJAx4DBon2r7tO-Tw&s=19

https://twitter.com/pwoloss/status/1501635877918986244?t=6q_z04p5pgh0l65PvmG1Pg&s=19

https://twitter.com/pwoloss/status/1501636863878127628?t=8Ol2GvSvFQICvgK3MW4irA&s=19

https://twitter.com/pwoloss/status/1501637041121075203?t=oyluqyEYMpI4l3RZIxegAg&s=19

https://twitter.com/pwoloss/status/1501637226580561926?t=ySGw_I9V1LvG99DBK9nKyw&s=19

4 Likes
44

Who mentioned Triple H?

1 Like
45

Ah, sorry - my mistake, I realize now you were meaning Delirious.

Will remove.

46

Written by someone in a bubble for people in that same bubble and absolutely not summed up by those tweets at all.

I’m telling you right now as a more than casual fan that I don’t know or care who Jay White or any other wrestler I don’t know or care about is, so when the commentator reacts like it’s some sort of huge deal then it just makes him look daft to those of us who aren’t in the niche fan bracket.

47

I’m surprised a more than occasional fan is unaware of who Jay White is. After all Suzuki got a monster reaction I’m sure a lot of their audience knows who he is.

I don’t always get the AEW references or people they bring in. I don’t know who Danhausen is. He looks like an idiot who ruins matches for no reason. He’s a goof. Yet I get that some people will know him and like that. Which is fine. The product isn’t made just for me. If I don’t like I don’t have to watch certain parts or even the whole thing.

However clearly they are appealing and growing their audience, getting great attendance figures and putting out well reviewed and received shows. They are doing a lot right by their audience.

The ROH deal is too early to judge. Vince buried WCW writhing a few months. I think TK will do better by ROH

1 Like
48

They are not growing their audience Alex. That’s the point.

I referred to myself as a more than casual fan because I still watch the occasional match/segment and listen to Podcasts.

The real casual fans don’t listen to Podcasts or follow wrestling online and don’t watch at all.

49

Look, I haven’t watched a complete NJPW show since WCW’s Japan Supershow III. Somehow, I manage to understand everything going on related to the stories and stars that appear on North American TV. Don’t think I’ve seen a full ROH show in almost a decade. Haven’t watched a full episode of Smackdown or Raw in at least as long.

Simply by listening and doing a bit of research after watching or hearing about something.

I’m not sure what bubble I am in, but sure?

Anyway - I just think that the attack on Excalibur is unwarranted. Watching him and Tony (who’s enthusiasm has been incredible to watch and listen to over the last two years), had been great.

Speaking of Tony - I’m not sure how anybody can watch what he’s done over the last two years, and not been impressed. He’s taken on plenty of responsibility, and has a genuine excitement that can’t be faked. He’s managed to resurrect his career, and play his role perfectly.

JR is terrible these days - regardless of the promotion, he’s too far gone.

You can have different preferences, and that’s fine. But you also just make stuff up to complain about.

And enough of the “Tony is just a mark with money”. When is the guy allowed to get credit? He’s hired an incredible team, and the roster is the deepest in wrestling, with arguably the most star power than anywhere in the last 15+ years.
They continue to grow and succeed. The majority of their markets demonstrate growth. Their critical acclaim is well earned, especially after the last PPV.

For example… This is slightly outdated, but an example of growth within the last year.

Year after year as well, PPV audiences continue to grow.

They have on average had higher ratings since moving to TBS as well.

They are expanding to new markets.

They just had their highest gate ever.

All examples of growth.

50

You’re literally complaining about a commentator doing a good job and explaining to the audience who talent are.

You don’t think maybe they will get some of the audience will become curious about who is introduced? And that they will look into those talents on their own?

Or, if not, just take the word of the commentator, and accept what’s happening?

51

That you don’t recognise you inhabit a microcosm of the potential wrestling audience and think casual fans have any inclination to research what they see being presented to them if they stumble upon or even potentially watch for a specific reason (e.g. Punks debut) sums up your disconnect from the definition of “casual fan” perfectly.

Talk about hyperbole. It was hardly an “attack”. It’s just an opinion. Read it, don’t read it. Agree with it, disagree with it.

I’ve given him credit for some stuff like how he has presented Punk, Bryan, etc. But until he stops paying all the dross he employees because they are friends of his Senior VPs and stops letting his Senior VPs bury their competition then I’ll continue to view him as a mark with money.

52

I’ve watched all the movies in the MCU. I haven’t actually ever read any comic books related to the characters. If I’m watching one of the films and there is some mention or tease that goes over my head, that doesn’t stop me from watching. Occasionally, I’ll go online and read about the meaning behind these Easter eggs. If I don’t understand or catch ever one of them, my experience isn’t lessened.

Is that a fair comparison to what we are talking about?

Am I a “casual MCU viewer”? Does that correlate?

Somehow, my viewing experience can be just as rewarding as it is for hardcore readers, because we enjoy things on different levels.

Myself and hundreds of millions of people who watch MCU films aren’t turned off by these inside references. But somehow, in your mind, when it’s applied to professional wrestling, everybody shuts down and can’t comprehend that things exist beyond what they have seen or experienced?

Not everybody will dig in and research - I never said they would. But some will. And I’m sure those who don’t will accept at face value that “oh, this person is somebody they’re telling me is a big deal somewhere, let’s see what they can do.” And they’ll be just fine.

Again, I think this goes actually to my larger point that the vague idea of a casual viewer doesn’t exist. You’re either engaged or not.

5 Likes
53

This is a brilliant analogy.

As long as the announcers explain it it’s not an issue. And they explain a lot of the stuff right away. If you then take the explanation at face value that’s one thing. If you choose to deeper dive that’s another thing. Choice is yours.

However complaining that you have no idea what is going on when the announcer told you isn’t really fair

3 Likes
54

I agree with this……I think there is a line, and you don’t want to be doing it constantly, but subtle references here and there for the hardcore fan is totally OK in my book.

I remember as a kid I was a huge WWF fan, I didn’t care about WCW (I started caring in the NWO days). When Flair came in, I didn’t know who he was, but they eluded to the fact that he was a star outside of WWE and that was enough for me to buy in. My point, is I didn’t need to know all the history, as long as they fill me in on the basics, the fact that I may not get every single small Easter egg so to speak is ok.

1 Like
55

I don’t watch NJPW and the references don’t bother me at all. If anything, the fact that he is giving me backstory I don’t know is a good thing.

As for Tony, I think he’s great, but I’ve always liked him even going back to his WCW days. It always bothered me how fans shit on him for things that weren’t his fault. Very similar to the way fans shit on Michael Cole now.

1 Like
56

But you aren’t a casual fan. My observation and point is from the view of a fan that isn’t a Patreon member of a wrestling podcast and posts on the associated forum!

I reiterate, watch Tony from his JCP days. Heck, don’t. How anyone can say he is good is perplexing to me.

57

When it comes to WWE and AEW, yes I’m a hardcore fan. When it comes to the indies, I am. I follow New Japan, Impact, GCW, ROH, NXT 2.0 online to a degree, but I rarely watch any of those shows. So, those references do go over my head at times.

1 Like
58

This is professional wrestling, the references to other wrestling organizations to fans of wrestling is pretty standard. This isn’t Dennis Miller making a reference to the Macedonian government in prior to world war one during monday night football. Whats going on here is more akin to someone watching “the Lord of the Rings” that hasn’t read the books.

2 Likes
59

No it isn’t. It’s specifically tailored to the audience they already attract. A casual fan doesn’t give two shits about Minoru Suzuki for example. To them (and me for that matter), he just looked like some random, dull, old guy who had walked in off the street. Zero charisma or interest to anyone outside the audience they already have.

Anyway, it’s clear the Stockholm syndrome prevents the majority of forum users from acknowledging that the current presentation will never attract a wider audience despite the overwhelming facts supporting this.

60

Can you watch any sport unless you know every single stat from the past 50 years? Can you watch a tv show that has lasted more than 5 years without a recap at the start of every episode?
I know most people can follow an NFL season without watching the college career of every single player they drafted, or being intimately knowledgeable of every free agent signing. But, somehow, the “casual” wrestling fan (who’s existence is debatable) can’t be expected to understand that the leader of Bullet Club is a big deal? Or that Ishii is a bad ass?

1 Like
61

I’m begging you to respond to my MCU comparison point. We all suffer Stockholm syndrome, but you hang onto the the delusion of the mythic moronic casual fan.

As for growth for AEW…

Again, I presented facts about PPV buyrates and attendance, both factors growing year after year as well.

3 Likes
62

Is there such a thing as “casual fans” anymore? With unlimited channels available on traditional television, a growing amount of streaming services, and you have a more fractured audience. A more fractured, but dedicated audience. The last few examples of modern zeitgeist were things like “Game of Thrones” and the “MCU”; which were not properties one could accuse of being traditionally popular. Or even geared toward a “casual” audience

2 Likes