Spoiler discussion/feedback for Doctor Strange and the Multiverse of Madness.
Join me, WH and John Siino live this Monday 1pm in the Café for a live MCU L8R spoiler discussion (no POST Daily News that day).
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Sean from Toronto
I’m sure there are people who will be disappointed that most of the multiverse cameos were reserved for the Illuminati scene, but it was neat seeing a live action depiction of Captain Carter from What If and the fan-favourite casting of John Krasinski as Reed Richards come to fruition and we can assume that Krasinski will also be playing the 616 version of the character in the upcoming Fantastic 4 film. I’d also like to believe that the inclusion of Black Bolt on the Illuminati means that Earth 838 is a universe where the announced Phase 3 Inhumans film was not cancelled and replaced with a poorly received ABC TV series (though bringing Anson Mount back in the role suggests the show was still somewhat canon).
From the start Multiverse of Madness was described as the MCU horror movie and while that was indeed the case in some aspects (particularly Scarlet Witch stalking the alternate Wanda), it ultimately ended up being not much different than most MCU films.
That said, I’m glad to see Sam Raimi return to the genre and bring Bruce Campbell with him, though I’m sure there are some who were disappointed after sitting through the credits just to have Bruce Campbell scream “It’s Over!”
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Scrump
I wanted to come here and rave about having the same cinematic experience that I did with Endgame and No Way Home, but this movie just failed to live up to the hype for me.
I’m not saying I didn’t enjoy the movie, it’s just not something I’m going to rush out to see again.
My biggest gripe is for a film called the “Multiverse of Madness”, there was very little Multiverse.
Aside from the scene with Strange and Chavez, you really only visit two other Multiverse worlds.
And while seeing Black Bolts head explode as well as the rest of the Illuminati wrecked was fun, not enough cameos.
I understand not wanting to pay Tom Cruise to be Superior Iron Man but you’re telling me they could shell out money to bring in some Legacy characters?
Nicholas Cage is broke and would’ve surely came in for the paycheck.
Good movie, just not what I expected.
Hopefully one day we get the Raimi cut of the 40 minutes he trimmed from the movie.
M
FYI, Nic Cage paid off his debts about a year and a half ago
Jay from Colorado
This movie felt like an homage to the Evil Dead Series. We got Evil Dead style camera cuts, an evil book, Bruce Campbell, demonic souls, the main character as a zombie, and campy lines like “Get the hell out of my universe!” And “…the Illumiwhati?”. I don’t have a problem with this as I love that series, Sam Raimi, and some campiness, but I don’t know if that translated into me liking this film more. It was fine. There were some cool scenes, some neat cameos, and America Chavez is a new favorite character for me. But it just didn’t hit me like I had hoped it would.
Also I remember reading that originally before the pandemic that Multiverse of Madness was to come out before No Way Home. How do you think both movies would have been different if the original plans hadn’t changed because of COVID? Was America Chavez supposed to be in No Way Home?
Yeah I have a girlfriend. You haven’t met her, it’s a long distance relationship. America is the taxi cab I use to see her.
Bold move to have ultron robits without a variant stark.
The illuminati felt a little underwhelming. It was nice to see them defeat Thanos to show they’re powerful but they also felt nerfed when they fell so quickly to Scarlet Witch.
Happy to see the tentacle monster.
Kids in my theatre seemed too young to know who Bruce Campbell was when he appeared
How does the illumanti seem nerfed against Wanda? She basically would have taken Thanos out by herself. If he didnt call an airstrike on her he wouldve been ripped apart. I think its more than believable shed waste the illumanti we saw. Easily. In my opinion
I had to think how to respond and it’s hard. I think my issue was the ratio of show vs tell that happened in the film, and that’s a very audience-specific metric so I see why it is different for you. In my mind, went too far into “tell” and not enough “show” when it came to establishing the powers of the illuminati. If we were used to these characters (even variants) from previous MCU instalments it might have been ok because we can’t take for granted MCU versions of characters are that similar to comic versions.
The number of minutes we actually see the Illuminati on screen and what they were doing in those minutes (and for all the fight scenes) was just getting beaten in a couple minutes each. For the first formal introduction of these characters, even in variant form, I think there needs to be a more happy medium of showing and telling if it was supposed to establish their power level before killing them off.
Thats fair. I understand now.
Overall, this was a bad movie.
The positives:
I enjoyed Wanda’s ruthlessness. The deaths of the Illuminati was the most gruesome in the MCU. Xochitl Gomez’s portrayal of America Chavez was amazing and I am looking forward to the Disney+ series. For me, I have no problem with how the Multiverse concept was handled in this movie.
The negatives:
Doctor Strange is a bland character. There shouldn’t be any more movies with him as the central character. The ending felt rushed and it felt disconnected from the rest of the movie. The movie had pacing issues. There were parts of the movie that were outright boring. The post credits scene has to be the worst post credits scene in history. The scene sets up the next movie where Dr. Strange has to fix an incursion that he created. So a similar movie as this one but Dr. Strange now has a stupid 3rd eye. I do not have high hopes for Phase 4 of the MCU
I can see your perspective too and it wasn’t until I evaluated why I felt off that I understood what another perspective would be. It’s why I like these forums.
Pretty sure that’s just to sell trashy third-eye sunglass merch.
Whatever I expected, this film was not it, but I mean that in a good way. The horror elements came as a surprise to me but I really enjoyed them. The fate of the Illuminati had me and most others at my showing laughing rather than suffering any temporary trauma.
I will say that recent MCU movies have lacked the cohesiveness of previous phases, but I don’t hate that at all. I’m happy to take each film as it’s released on its own merits. Feige and co have built up more than enough credit with me to trust that they know where they are going.
Having watched WandaVision (still in my top two Disney+ shows) enhanced this film enormously. She had better not be dead.
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15 years away from the genre gave Sam Raimi somewhat of a chip on his shoulder. He didn’t sacrifice his identity to fit into the MCU machine. Doctor Strange & the Multiverse of Madness is unapologetically a Raimi film as he injects some of his horror sensibilities (gruesome deaths, POV shots, body horror) into the proceedings. Liz Olsen is, far and away, the MVP. WandaVision was crucial to this film’s success as her arc is being built upon from her time in Westview. Cumberbatch, Gomez and Wong all deliver quality performances.
Overall, it’s a testament to auteurism in being effective.
As cool as it was to see the Illuminati. It wouldn’t be a Raimi film without Bruce Campbell.
Chris Elliot
Whilst this wasn’t up there as one of the best MCU movies, I’d have to say it was a solid show. When it was announced and word got round this would be a horror movie of sorts, I was definitely intrigued as to how they’d pull it off whilst keeping it within the current boundaries of the MCU and it’s appeal to kids. So me and my 2 boys went to check it out and they loved it. The majority of the jump scares were great and the gore was just enough to look good without becoming overly disgusting. Also I wasn’t sure I’d ever see something to top Hulk’s exploding death in What If, but Black Bolt’s head imploding was incredible.
As for the 2nd post credits scene, I was laughing hysterically at its absurdity although there were a lot of people in my screening grumbling about it being a waste of time
James
This was the first MCU film I got to watch ‘live’ after committing to the universe in January - can’t thank you enough for all the reviews and primers to get me up to scratch.
I’ve really enjoyed the different feels each Disney series/film have had in phase 4 and this was no different. I thought Scarlett Witch was terrifying and MVP of the film and am looking forward to future appearances of Chavez. A film I’ll probably have to rewatch once clued in on all the characters introduced and their importance but still an enjoyable one for me.
Will
This movie was fine. Wanda doing a T-1000 impersonation was the best part of the movie. I want to see her in more movies, but unless they give her the same treatment they gave Jason Statham in the Fast movies, she’ll have to stay a villain. The cameos in my theatre got laughs. People were laughing at Jim from The Office trying to act and then getting killed in two seconds. The book of Ashanti, more like “this book is just here for the plot”. Would’ve liked to see more multiverses than just the universe where New York City cares about the environment. Overall, an ok movie. Definitely wouldn’t call it a horror movie.
I had a lot of fun with this film. As a big Raimi fan I was glad his style and sensibilities had a chance to shine through. It was very vibrant and kinetic, a great mix of both horror and fantasy.
It was interesting in how Strange and Wanda’s stories played off each other. Temptation was a major theme of the movie, with Wanda fully giving in while Strange was able to turn away from it and get closure to his relationship with Christine.
Do you think the Illuminati scene will be the spark that leads to Secret Wars? I can see 838 leading an invasion or seeking revenge on 616 for killing off the Illuminati which seemed like that universe’s Avengers.
Also I just want to say that I listen to a lot of Marvel related content and MCU L8R is by far my favorite. Keep up the great work!
Keep up the great work guys, MCUL8R is always a highlight. Jonathan Hickman’s Marvel run from Fantastic Four ending in Secret Wars is my favorite comic book run of all time and the fact that the MCU seems to be tackling it’s own version of the story with Phase 4 has me extremely excited. I enjoyed Dr. Strange but honestly I’m more excited for future movies. Do you think we will see The Maker introduced into the Marvel Universe? Also, the ending of Secret Wars served as a way to streamline continuity and reboot the comic universe, do you think we will see something similar in the MCU? Has the MCU essentially become too convoluted for the casual audience and will we see them potentially reboot?
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I didn’t get to see the movie over the weekend because of Mothers Day plans which was a big bummer because spoilers were everywhere.
But I finally got to see it tonight and even though I had a few surprises spoiled there were others I didn’t know about so it was still a lot of fun. Similar to the other Phase 4 movies so far Multiverse of Madness was a mixed bag with some incredible moments and head-scratching decisions. But I still came away entertained and looking forward to what’s next.
Pros:
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Sam Rami. Just two words. 20 years later he’s still making comic book movies that feel entirely unique and quirky. It’s always impressive how a director that can make a Marvel movie their own.
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Elizabeth Olsen as the MVP of the movie doing a fantastic job playing a wide range of emotions.
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Incredible uses of magic. Some of the best magical stuff I’ve ever seen. The battle with the music was so creative. I’ve never seen anything like that.
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The levels of nerdiness. The illuminati. Universe designations. Baxter Foundation. Incursions. Wundagore mountain. As a comic book fan it still blows my mind that Marvel continues to find unused lore from their books to inspire the movies. Lots of fun stuff.
Cons (mostly minor nit-picks)
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Where was Kang? The movie felt like a direct sequel to WandaVision and What-If. So I was surprised not to see Kang in the post-credits stinger.
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The fall of Wanda felt a little rushed. A little like Daenerys in GoT S8. Yes Wanda had made some mistakes in WandaVision. But she went full heel really quickly. It might have been helpful to better know how long the Darkhold had been influencing her.
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America Chavez was a little bland. That’s not really the movie or actresses fault. I find her really bland in the comics. She has a cool power that looks spectacular on the page or on the screen. But in the books I’ve read she never really developed much of a personality.
My Phase 4 movie ranking so far:
- Spider-Man No Way Home
- Black Widow (I get the impression I liked this one way more than most)
- Dr Strange Multiverse of Madness
- Eternals
- Shang Chi