I think the actual truth is in between the 2 positions here. Yeah, spot monkeys are boring and repetitive. But reverse chinlocks and head locks are also boring. Relying on only one school of thought is extremely limiting and short sighted. But complaining that moves aren’t finishers anymore…that comes down to the bookers. Blame them.
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Looking at the WWE demo and the product they introduce the later years… you sure you didn’t misspelled them here?
The audacity of saying this after the match they had… take your WWE glasses off, pls.
What audacity? I haven’t seen that match but based on the FTR matches I saw before I stopped watching Dynamite they were being pulled down by their opponents due to accommodating the spot monkey shit rather than raising their opponents by refusing to do so and teaching them how to work a pro-wrestling match.
Nope. I wasn’t talking about WWE as they are irrelevant to the point I made.
Jesus H Christ…
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I think he is right and wrong. Pro wrestling has evolved, but that doesn’t make it better and I think the reason is “finisher” culture. The idea of finishing moves winning matches is what causes things to get over used or phased into transition moves. When the DDT was a finisher barely anyone was using it outside the guys finishing with it, now lots of people use it and it cannot be everyone’s finish. Same with the super kick. Unless promotions are going to restrict move sets and tell wrestlers “hey you cannot throw a side kick (super kick) in you matches.” People won’t buy it as a finish unless literally every time anyone hits it that is what happens. Now if more matches actually ended off of non-finisher moves, then you wouldn’t have the same issue. But if John Cena finishes everyone with the AA/FU, but also hits a DDT in a lot of matches and never finishes anyone then unless a guy finishing with a DDT makes it special in some way no one is going to buy into it as a great “finishing move.”
In the end more matches should end on different types of moves. Guys can still have their “finisher” i.e. a move they are really good at that usually wins them a match, but they shouldn’t always finish matches with it. It is one of the things I think Omega has done well with. He doesn’t always use the “One winged angel” to finish his matches, but when he does it is truly over.
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So based on your response you are telling me The Young Bucks wrestled FTR’s match rather than their usual bullshit style?
I haven’t been following WWE in over a year, not even NXT and the product was already awful to me for years before that. So awful that i never even paid attention to FTR until they became FTR in AEW, now they’re among my favourites. Even back in the day i was more of a WCW guy, hell i even spent a few years watching TNA/ROH over WWE. I’m very much not a WWE guy.
Yet i have “WWE glasses” because in the same breath as stating the Young Bucks are why i got back into wrestling i dared to slightly criticise their style. This AEW vs WWE bullshit is nauseating.
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Indeed it is, but the “it might be bad but at least it isn’t as bad as WWE” is the default defence, as it is the only defence.
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You mean WCW, speaking of WWE?
What are you talking about?
This isn’t directed at anyone in particular, but it really really is. In any other field of entertainment this type of mentality would be laughed at. Imagine seeing a fan of Amazon Prime ripping into “Netflix fans” because Amazon Prime is catching up in subscribers. Or a Netflix fan ripping an “Amazon Prime fan“ because they aren’t successful enough. Why would this never happen? Because it would be weird.
Can’t we all just praise WWE and AEW when they do something good, and be able to criticize each when they do something we don’t like? We are all wrestling fans, what’s best for this industry is for all the top promotions to be thrive. Let’s just hope for good wrestling and stop pretending like we are a part of either promotion. If you praise or criticize WWE, lets not make it about AEW. If you praise or criticize AEW, let’s not make it about WWE.
If you like something, watch it. If you hate something, don’t watch it. It’s simple. Only in wrestling lol.
I don’t disagree with this, especially based on what I said above, but what do you expect when you come in guns a blazing every time AEW is mentioned.
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I agree with just about everything JR said, and it seems many here do as well. My only issue is that, as someone in a position of power within the company, it’s kind of shitty to go disparaging the product you represent. He’s being paid by AEW to promote the product and encourage people to watch this amazing show, not to crap all over it and talk bad about the guys working there.
As JR himself has said, everybody eats off the same plate. So if a lower-card guy feels that JR’s words might be discouraging potential viewers from tuning in and taking food off his plate, I can’t blame him for being upset. If JR wants to publicly criticize and lambaste the product, he ought to step away from the company and take the Cornette approach and do it independently. There is certainly a market for these things.
I mean, WWE has stoked this tribalism for two decades with there constant retelling and revision of the Monday Night Wars. Rightly or wrongly. This is on them for the way they’ve spend decades trying to tell fans that those were the most important part of their history.
And let’s not pretend this sort of us vs them attitude doesn’t exist in other realms.
And while sure - your example of Netflix vs Amazon Prime is odd… I know that there is constantly a battle between many Marvel and DC fans for instance. Or Xbox vs PS.
Brands build their bases by making them part of their audience’s identity.
Coke vs Pepsi. Android vs iPhone. PC vs Mac.
I’m not saying it’s right. I’m just saying this brand identity exists everywhere.
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I’m not denying WWE is responsible for it based on the Monday Night Wars, and my comment is just as much aimed at WWE fans as AEW fans.
In all those examples I think its silly for fans to get so emotionally invested to the point where they have such hatred for “the other side”. Like I said, if someone hates WWE, I get it, totally understandable and I would strongly recommend to them to not watch it. When certain people hate AEW and rip on it in every thread, same idea, if you hate it and you don’t watch it, why waste your time bashing it.
I agree brand intensity exists, but that doesn’t make it any less silly.
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If only life were so simple…
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I guess because he is not wasting time in his own mind. He is using it in the best way he can imagine which makes it 10 times sadder.
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Tribalism when it comes to brands does exist and it’s stupid everytime. Not to say people can’t have preferences but an intense, emotional mentality of “Us vs. Them” is ridiculous. Especially when talking about wrestling promotions. Said it before AEW existed when talking about NXT, but chanting the name of the promotion is fucking stupid.