I’m a fan of tournaments. I’d be all up for it. Although I have no issue with ‘qualifiers’ for the tourney on TV
I love a one-night tournament, but I don’t think they’ve ever drawn well for WWE as a pay-per-view. Exception being Deadly Game in late 1998, when basically anything they booked was going to draw a big number.
Not really a thing anymore though with the Network’s subscription based model.
WWF KING OF THE RING PREVIEW - JUNE 23, 1996
- Yokozuna def. Scotty Flamingo (c) to win the WWF World Heavyweight Championship
- Ted DiBiase def. Wildman Marc Mero to win the King of the Ring
- Mr Perfect def. Hunter Hearst Helmsley to retain the WWF Intercontinental Championship
- Ted DiBiase def. Billy Gunn in a KOTR Quarter-Final Match
- Wildman Marc Mero def. Jerry Lawler in a KOTR Semi-Final Match
- Ted DiBiase def. Brian Pillman in a KOTR Semi-Final Match
- Camp Corntte def. The Million Dollar Corporation to win the Tag Team Championships when Owen pinned The Kid
- Marc Mero def. Ax in a KOTR Quarter-Final Match
- Jerry Lawler def. Steve Austin in a KOTR Quarter-Final Match
- Brian Pillman def. Nailz in a KOTR Quarter-Final Match
- Ted DiBiase def. Billy Gunn in a KTOR Quarter-Final Match
WORLD WRESTLING FEDERATION
World Heavyweight Champion: Yokozuna - NEW
Intercontinental Champion: Mr. Perfect (2) - 56 days
Tag Team Champions: Camp Cornette - NEW
WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP WRESTLING
World Heavyweight Champion: Ricky Steamboat - 280 days
United States Champion: Brad Armstrong - 7 days
Tag Team Champions: The Blue Bloods - 341 days
KING OF THE RING WINNERS
- 1986 - Junkyard Dog
- 1987 - ‘Jumpin’ Jim Brunzell
- 1988 - Harley Race
- 1989 - Ax
- 1990 - Bret ‘Hitman’ Hart
- 1991 - The Ultimate Warrior
- 1993 - Kerry Von Erich
- 1994 - Owen Hart
- 1995 - Scotty Flamingo
- 1996 - Ted DiBiase
1 Like
WCW BASH AT THE BEACH PREVIEW - JULY 7, 1996
TWO ON THREE HANDICAP MATCH - WHO’S THE THIRD MAN?
The Outsiders & ??? vs. Sting, Randy Savage, & Lex Luger
UNITED STATES CHAMPIONSHIP MATCH
Brad Armstrong (c) vs. 2 Cold Scorpio
The Steiner Brothers vs. Harlem Heat
John Tenta vs Big Bubba Rogers
Dean Malenko vs Disco Inferno
WCW WORLD TAG TEAM CHAMPIONSHIP MATCH
The Blue Bloods (c) vs. The Faces of Fear
Ric Flair vs. Konnan
DOUBLE DOG COLLAR MATCH
The Nasty Boys vs. The Public Enemy
Rey Mysterio Jr vs Psicosis
WORLD WRESTLING FEDERATION
World Heavyweight Champion: Yokozuna - 14 days
Intercontinental Champion: Mr. Perfect (2) - 70 days
Tag Team Champions: Camp Cornette - 14 days
WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP WRESTLING
World Heavyweight Champion: Ricky Steamboat - 294 days
United States Champion: Brad Armstrong - 21 days
Tag Team Champions: The Blue Bloods - 355 days
I am just so intrigued to see if Hogan being the third man is a fixed point in time or not!
2 Likes
Guaranteed it’s not Muraco or Warrior!
2 Likes
If Hogan joining is not a fixed point, Im calling a Steamboat heel turn.
3 Likes
WCW BASH AT THE BEACH RESULTS - JULY 7, 1996
- The Outsiders & Hulk Hogan vs Lex Luger, Sting & Randy Savage went to a no contest
- 2 Cold Scorpio def. Brad Armstrong (c) to win the WCW United States Championship
- Harlem Heat def. The Steiner Brothers
- John Tenta vs Big Bubba Rogers
- Disco Inferno def. Dean Malenko
- The Faces of Fear def. The Blue Bloods (c) to win the WCW World Tag Team Titles
- Ric Flair def. Konnan
- The Nasty Boys def. The Public Enemy in a Double Dog Collar Match
- Rey Mysterio Jr def. Psicosis
WORLD WRESTLING FEDERATION
World Heavyweight Champion: Yokozuna - 14 days
Intercontinental Champion: Mr. Perfect (2) - 70 days
Tag Team Champions: Camp Cornette - 14 days
WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP WRESTLING
World Heavyweight Champion: Ricky Steamboat - 294 days
United States Champion: 2 Cold Scorpio (2) - NEW
Tag Team Champions: The Faces of Fear - NEW
1 Like
So the NWO appears to be inevitable in any universe then.
I would be interested in @Sancty’s analysis of how the wrestling business and WWF and WCW are doing in the simulation compared to history?
You’ve made the point before that Hogan didn’t become the same level of dominant superstar of the 80’s as he did in real life. Does his heel turn in the simulation even mean that much to the audience?
And there are other stars that haven’t achieved the same level of greatness in the simulation as real life. The Undertakers been beaten at WrestleMania. Bret Hart didn’t win the title until 1996. Has Scotty Flamingo really been “putting asses in seats” for the past year? Or is wrestling really in a down period right now?
1 Like
You pose some really interesting questions and it’s hard to answer a lot of them because it depends on our understanding of whose these performers are over 20 plus years of fandom and then stepping outside of that and trying to pretend we don’t know these things that we so intrinsically know. There are elements I’m rooting for and elements I’m rooting against.
The nWo was a fixed point - no question. Eric Bischoff was going to be in Japan and he was going to see ‘that’ storyline and he was going to emulate it in WCW which in any universe would be against the machine.of WWF and needing to make a splash.
Although the nWo was a fixed point, Hulk Hogan wasn’t a certainty. A couple of years out I thought that The Ultimate Warrior was a reasonable shout for star power (but he wasn’t that big of a draw in The WWF and some creative thinking might be needed to justify). Another big name was Ricky Steamboat but his very successful latter day run doesn’t scream heel turn. Had he lost to Hogan in the build-up - maybe. Hogan on the other hand, he’s now up there in the Mount Rushmore conversation. It’s him, Flair, and Magnum T.A. Magnum has been almost irrelevant for the last 2 years, propping up the midcard and clearly having lost something, and Flair can’t be wrenched away from The Horsemen.
Hogan is a 5 time World Champion (4 WWF, 1 WCW), and the current PWI #1 wrestler but has repeatedly hit his head when trying to win against Steamboat. He’s the poster-boy for a heel turn such as this and it would’ve been massive. I’d argue actually that Hogan’s career has never had the high of the Hulkamania era of real life but he’s actually been much more of a fixture in the 1990-1994 era than real-life Hogan was.
Things are lagging a bit for some guys, absolutely. Bret Hart (probably the next event I need to consider if it’s a ‘fixed point’ is SS 1997) is a couple of years behind and guys like Sting, Taker, Savage never hit the highs they were supposed to while Scott Levy is a Main Eventer in this world (an outcome I’ve been very much hoping for the opposite as I still want to see his gimmick shift to Raven). However, I do think that Scotty Flamingo is a poster boy for a failed attempt to build The New Generation around.
Scotty is an interesting example. He oversucceeded in WCW with the BattleBowl win, he got randomly placed in a tag team with Razor Ramon in the WWF who then won the tag straps, he turned that into a KOTR win and won IC and World gold in short supply thereafter. Shawn and Marty both got to the mountaintop (Shawn way ahead of schedule, and Marty’s an anomaly). Also, the prevention of real-life deaths / career-ending injuries in the 2nd way through resulted in the need for a chaos theory element (which we’ve seen play out with long layoffs to Taker, Tatanka, Boss Man and the premature retirement [and then return] of Rick Rude and even a few deaths.
Now what does this mean for the wrestling business? Most elements are beyond my control and I have to treat them as written. I have to assume that Eric Bischoff and Vince remain on their respective career paths and even that most contracts are written around the same perspective. To accurately try and retrograde these events would be unmanageable and moreso a venture for something like TEW 2020 (a great game by the way). How would I measure that WWF is doing better than WCW in the late 90s/early 2000s and is it likely always a guarantee that the WWF wins - yeah, it’s probably a fixed point. The WWF will always have Austin, The Rock, Taker, Foley, Kane, at that time frame and unless the chaos dynamic shifts any of this or causes any unexpected situations, it’s my prediction that history doesn’t want to be changed and we will therefore end up at the same endpoint of WWE/AEW in 2023
2 Likes
Incredible analysis Sancty.
As an outside observer who has just been following along with the results my impression is that without Hogan becoming a dominant face of the industry in the 1980’s that WWF/wrestling never reached the same level of popularity at that time. And the repercussions of that are being felt in the simulation today. To maintain an audience WWF didn’t get as cartony in the Rock N’ Roll era or the New Generation era as it did in real life so its shows are seen as slightly more serious and have maintained a hardcore fan base through the 80’s and 90’s keeping the company alive but not thriving. WCW is in a similar position but has a much bigger safety net being owned by Turner.
So if WCW is about to go on an 83 week ratings winning streak because the NWO angle really works then WWF will be in some massive financial trouble in 1997-1998 even if they are able to improve their product and get some momentum by focusing on Stone Cold Steve Austin.
Survivor Series 1997 will be interesting. In my mind the screwjob only happens if its Bret as champion vs Michaels and Bret’s contract is up. If the simulation has another champion or contender at SS97 then the screwjob doesn’t happen. And the ramifications of that would be seen throughout the rest of the 90’s.
That’s a very specific kettle of fish. I really haven’t focused on a women’s division to this point so you don’t get Alundra Blayze so the Screwjob likely doesn’t domino that way full stop.
As for the 83 week run. Hogan is the biggest name in the sport today (prior to the turn) and is on Mt Rushmore with Flair, Magnum, and Orndorff as the biggest names in the sport’s history (probably on pair with Flair and both behind Magnum a bit so I think his run has legitimised Wrestling but we never got Hulkamania proper I’d guess - although we did get WM1 [as per history], WM2 [Hogan vs Piper], and WM3 [Andre over Hogan], WM7 [Magnum over Hogan], and WMX [Hogan over Crush] - so that’s 5 legitimate Hulk Hogan Main Events at WrestleMania compared to 6 IRL [not counting IX], so Hulkamania isn’t exactly a non-entitiy. He did yield the top spot to Magnum for a couple of years, which has probably prevented overexposure and arguably kept face Hogan more relevant leading into the heel turn.
1 Like
`
WWF IN YOUR HOUSE 9: INTERNATIONAL INCIDENT PREVIEW - JULY 21, 1996
SIX MAN TAG
Camp Cornette (Vader, Owen, Bulldog) vs. Shawn Michaels, Ahmed Johnson & Yokozuna
The Undertaker vs. Goldust
Make A Difference Fatu vs The Brooklyn Brawler
Jake ‘The Snake’ Roberts vs. ‘Stone Cold’ Steve Austin
Henry O. Godwinn vs Mankind
WORLD WRESTLING FEDERATION
World Heavyweight Champion: Yokozuna - 28 days
Intercontinental Champion: Mr. Perfect (2) - 84 days
Tag Team Champions: Camp Cornette - 28 days
WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP WRESTLING
World Heavyweight Champion: Ricky Steamboat - 308 days
United States Champion: 2 Cold Scorpio (2) - 14 days
Tag Team Champions: The Faces of Fear - 14 days
`
WWF IN YOUR HOUSE 9: INTERNATIONAL INCIDENT RESULTS - JULY 21, 1996
SIX MAN TAG
Camp Cornette (Vader, Owen, Bulldog) def. Shawn Michaels, Ahmed Johnson & Yokozuna when Owen Hart pinned WWF Champion Yokozuna
Goldust def. The Undertaker
Make A Difference Fatu def. The Brooklyn Brawler
Jake ‘The Snake’ Roberts def. ‘Stone Cold’ Steve Austin
Mankind def. Henry O. Godwinn
WORLD WRESTLING FEDERATION
World Heavyweight Champion: Yokozuna - 28 days
Intercontinental Champion: Mr. Perfect (2) - 84 days
Tag Team Champions: Camp Cornette - 28 days
WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP WRESTLING
World Heavyweight Champion: Ricky Steamboat - 308 days
United States Champion: 2 Cold Scorpio (2) - 14 days
Tag Team Champions: The Faces of Fear - 14 days
WCW HOG WILD PREVIEW - AUGUST 10, 1996
WCW WORLD HEAVYWEIGHT CHAMPIONSHIP MATCH
Ricky ‘The Dragon’ Steamboat (c) vs. Sting
WCW UNITED STATES CHAMPIONSHIP MATCH
2 Cold Scorpio (c) vs. Larry Zbyszko
Ric Flair vs. Eddie Guerrero
WCW WORLD TAG TEAM CHAMPIONSHIPS
The Faces of Fear (c) vs. Arn Anderson & Chris Benoit
Rey Misterio Jr vs. Ultimo Dragon
Lex Luger & Randy Savage vs. The Outsiders
Hollywood Hogan vs. The Giant
The Nasty Boys vs. The Steiner Brothers
WORLD WRESTLING FEDERATION
World Heavyweight Champion: Yokozuna - 49 days
Intercontinental Champion: Mr. Perfect (2) - 105 days
Tag Team Champions: Camp Cornette - 49 days
WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP WRESTLING
World Heavyweight Champion: Ricky Steamboat - 329 days
United States Champion: 2 Cold Scorpio (2) - 35 days
Tag Team Champions: The Faces of Fear - 35 days
Now I’m wondering, Is Starrcade 97 a point that can’t be changed
I think A LOT has to go correctly. Sting needs to ascend to top of the card status. We shall see if that happens this week after a shock insertion into the main event of Hog Wild.
2 Likes
WCW HOG WILD RESULTS - AUGUST 10, 1996
- Ricky ‘The Dragon’ Steamboat (c) def. Sting to retain the WCW World Heavyweight Championship
- 2 Cold Scorpio (c) def. Larry Zbyszko to retain the WCW United States Championship
- Ric Flair def. Eddie Guerrero
- The Faces of Fear (c) def. Arn Anderson & Chris Benoit to retain the WCW Tag Team Championship
- Ultimo Dragon def. Rey Misterio Jr.
- Lex Luger & Randy Savage def. The Outsiders
- Hollywood Hogan def. The Giant
- The Steiner Brothers def. The Steiner Brothers
WORLD WRESTLING FEDERATION
World Heavyweight Champion: Yokozuna - 49 days
Intercontinental Champion: Mr. Perfect (2) - 105 days
Tag Team Champions: Camp Cornette - 49 days
WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP WRESTLING
World Heavyweight Champion: Ricky Steamboat - 329 days
United States Champion: 2 Cold Scorpio (2) - 35 days
Tag Team Champions: The Faces of Fear - 35 days
The Outsiders get jobbed out for being WWF guys before their WCW push starts? Is Vince booking this?